Peshawar about to fall
submitted 2 months 11 days 12 hours ago by: Khalifah : 68 commentsAccording to Dawn and other daily newspapers fall of Peshawar seems imminent barring any last minute, unlikely heroics by the Pakistani army.
Let me repeat that PESHAWAR is about to fall!
Is anyone listening?
Yet once again, the institution that was created to protect Pakistan has presided, nay assisted in the breakup of the Republic
I can see it now; NWFP separates from Pakistan and an independent country comprising of NWFP and Pashtun majority areas of Afghanistan is created.
Another country consisting of Balochistan and Baloch majority areas of Afghanistan is created
Sindh becomes independent while Punjab gets abosorbed into India
Thats the future that Khalifahdamos sees
The sad part is that even if these events do come to pass people of "Pakistan' will shrug their shoulders, blame God's will and move on with their lives.
I guess there is something to say about lack of education; it makes you oblivious to your exploitation
Comments
You know the people of Kashmir don't consider themselves a part of Pakistan. When they talk to you they say, 'when you go back to Pakistan...'
Today I was thinking Pakistan actually needs to be broken down into smaller units, like early days, their own weapons,needs and tribes and then let's see whether any social responsibility develops in these cubic units. Would they associate themselves with the needs of a smaller community then? I have no hope but it might be worthwhile- anything to shake them up!
Peshawar is about to fall what do you mean Khalifah i live in Peshawar i am from NWFP how can you predict some thing and you live abroad. There is no such thing how can a person say that Pustuns want there future with Pakistan and i don't think what ever is posted is likely to happen.
yeah the situation is steadily deteiorating....police has given up patrolling at night (especially in suburbs) after a patrol was blown up by a rocket-propelled grenade... i believe Gen kayani visit to FC HQ couple of days ago has sth to do with it....army has been on the defensive for too long...
It’s okay. Obviously Khalifah is overly concerned about the situation while being totally out of touch with the ground realities. May be Peshawar in United States of America is falling apart, the one we know in Pakistan is quite intact.
Plant a tree
My brother who is a Pathan told me so
I am sure it will all settle to nothing once by-elections are over. We know of a group that created a lot of fear factor before general elections too. Almost every school in Lahore and Karachi received bomb threatening calls in months before general elections.
Obviously there are people who do not support democracy in Pakistan.
Plant a tree
So.....U beleive every thing, which is told u?????????
If I say that Mr. Khalifa is going to ..................... would u beleive it? Plz don't mind what I'm saying.
No patriotic Pakistani can even think so what u have posted. I got shocked really to read all that. We should pray to Allah that He may keep our beloved homeland, Pakistan intact and give it prosperity n strength.
RizSh
The sky is falling. The sky is falling!
tell zardari house party ( PPP-ZHP)
Worst case scenario:
Peshawar will fall along with NWFP, a civil unrest will start Musharaff will be toppled a state of civil war will start with insurgence fighting from the Peshawar moving towards Islamabad, Russia & USA will both be the official sponsors of the war don't your remember what we did with Russians using the same people so now what you sow so shall you reap. Probably provinces will try to declare independence and Pakistan will be in a state of civil war, US will send troops to take control of the Nuclear Assets and then retaliation might start against US as people will find a common enemy. At this very moment a leader will rise and i guess he will reunite the separated people hang many Generals, Politicians and the the words "REVOLUTION" will become common.
Peshwar fall??
In my buzz once i had written that Amarica is seeding a new state of IMARAT-E-ISLAMI Waziristan..It will be constituted by Both waziristan and nearby agencies...But at that time few buzzers thought it a conspiracy theory..
I dont think peshawar will be a part of that AMARAT.it cant be becasue yet state has its writ there..This threat is about the above said areas..Thsi all is happening due to two parralel policies of NWFP Govt and Center...Center is not supportign peace process because of international pressure. Moreover when a state is not protecting its citizen from external Bombarment ..why people will remain part of that state....If talibans are there then how much they are?? just 3500-4000 and for them we are punishing a population of 2.5 million...
Yesterday PM has given free hand to NWFP governor and army action is now in hands of Army chief...The more dangerous policy being adopted by center...
u know what we are all responsible 4 that coz we don't have unity and love among us, pakistan has 4 provinces one is sindho desh second one is pakhtonistan but where is pkistan and this all due to less or no faith on ALLAH nd our distance to QURAN nd SUNNAH, we use "I" not "WE" if we discuss our problems. like ALLAMA IQBAL SAID may ALLAH BLESS HIM
"YUN TO SAYYAD BHI HO MIRZA BHI HO AFGHAN BHI HO
" TUM SABHI KUCH HO'BATAO TO MUSALMAAN BHI HO?????"
Fatima!
Well why is it so important to be a Muslim before being a patriot? Can patriots not overcome socio-religious and sociocultural differences? Is nationalism dependent upon religion merely?
@Fatima
100 % agree with you...
@Iola
I agree with fatima as our elders got this pakistan in the name of Islam,and there was no any other base.Now this would happen to us because now we new generation have left the teachings of islam.so now there no any valid reason to live together in pakistan.Either we should become the true muslim or should be readdy to all of this..........
Pakistan was created for Muslim minorities of India and not for Islam. Created for Muslims and created for Islam are two very separate things.
I totally agree with Iowa. We don't need Islam to feel patriotic towards Pakistan. Pakistan is for every Pakistani Muslim or non-Muslim. We should feel like a nation without a religious prejudice.
Plant a tree
Abid!
How do you propose us becoming true Muslims? Do you think the whole country is going to agree to how you define Islam, in the first place?
And in the second place, do we live in Pakistan because we are Muslims or because we don't have another choice to live elsewhere?
Thirdly if Pakistan was made for all Muslims, why haven't the rest of the Muslims all ova the world chosen it as their sanctity like the Jews chose Jerusalem?
IOLA : Fatima just narrated a verse...Moreover if a person is a muslim then why he/she looks for any other identity? Why baloch pathan and etc etc...Muslim shoudl have firm belief in its ideology....Patriotism is a seprate sentiment...It is also a truth that only patriotism is not enough to bound people in one chain..
Because he has neva been exposed to a choice of religion! Why can he or she not look for another religion or at least doubt that ours is the best religion? Why is that so impossible to imagine?
At that time to get Pakistan, it was vital to have an idealogy that everyone would adhere to. We stood united believing that due to our religious differences with the Hindu community we shall not be able to have a peaceful coexistence with them. "Direct Action Day" was one of the tactics to convince them of that. The call was made by Jinnah himself just to prove that unity all ova the subcontinent.
What is patriotism required for? I think in today's world it only comes into play when we talk about a war. I don't know what else we call ourselves a patriot for nowadays.
I mean ppl group together if they find that their interests are being safeguarded so there exists a reason to get together. Nowadays for the Pakistanis nothing is powerful enough to bind them together. They feel closer in smaller units like that of Balochi and Pashtun and so on.
How do you expect religion to be something to bring them together when each one of us does not believe in the same interpretation of religion?
I loved the long march. You know why? Not because it restored the judges or showed the superiority of the judiciary but because for once the common man and the lawyers all stood up TOGETHER for something.
First we have to learn to stand up for our rights and what we believe in and then we have to take the gauntlet to have a government that would truly protect our interests. Not by carrying out all Islamic acts and practices but by resolving issues which are common problems for all of us.
Also think about our 5-10% minority population. They love Pakistan & not because they are Muslims. Please do not isolate these very fascinating people who have made great contributions for our Nation.
Lets for example take Justice Rana Bhagwandas. Unlike Chawdhary Ifftikhar, Justice Rana Bhagwandas was not sacked. Instead he opted to join the struggle for a principle stand. He could have easily and most rightfully (being senior most) be the CJ today. How can we forget his sacrifices for our Nation.
Plant a tree
The elders might have wanted to make Islam the religion of Pakistan but it was never GOT in the name of the said.
In any case 22 elders just got creamed by the Islamists.
So I suggest you people better graduate Highschool in a hurry else itswill university level in hindi not Urdu!
Babar bhai...
We are not talkign about minorities...we are talkign about majority and this majority established a country on a principle of Islam...We are facign trouble becasue we are trying to get rid of that base...The nation who change the principle stand mostly get disperssed as Russia who exploited the actual communism(socialism) to get hold of its people...as Castro is exploiting as Gaddafi is doing....
Minorities are our part....they are servign the country...we need to follow our principle stand (islam) which tells us to protect minority rights...Teh weak ideology leads to weak patriotism...If you and Iola are referign to change our ideology and we should accpet "SAB SAY PEHLAY PAKISTAN " then you people haev seen Musharaf's failure with this slogan...Now we are alone...Even Iran is not supporting us..China is careful about our foreign matters...Turkkey, Saudi arabia, 1st time in our history Saudi govt denied our request for subsidize patrol..
Mianjee, Pakistan was created because at that time it was felt that muslims would be persecuted by the Hindu majority after the British departure. That is, it was created as a safe haven for the muslims and not with the intention of creating an Islamic theocratic state. That would have been suicidal on the part of Parsi Jinnah, who would have been persecuted like the Qadiani's in the very country that he created!
Mianjee nahi samjhain ge! :)
If Pakistan was made for the rule of Islam, then why has she neva been declared a theocracy, even right in the start when the emotions were running high?
Jinnah used to drink in the evenings and take bacon in the mornings, do you think he did it for Islam? No, he did it for securing a country for a vast majority of Muslims who had a different way of living than the other majority- for peaceful and free existence!
Mianjee,
My purpose is not to disagree but to bring few more ideas to this debate.
I have failed to link patriotism for country and for religion. They are two separate constructs and should always be treated as such. Why do we have to compare and rank two on the same scale?
There are many such examples around the globe where people have loved their country and have followed a separate religion to that of the majority. Then why can’t we have the two separated?
I think “Pakistan First” stand true for me not because the religion comes after but it standard first because I love my country more then any other country in the world.
Plant a tree
BABAR: I didnt mix it but IOLA qouted above that there is no use of religon for patriotism...If a single ideology will eb there it will prepare country men to go ahead for teh sake of stability of that ideological state...
Khalifah: There is no evidence that Jinnah sahib was Parsi...His wife was parsi, she died..His daughter was marrying a parsi person so he left her..what else it proves that except he believed in islamic view..
IOLA: Jinnah believed it thats why he invited Molana Modoodi who was a strong believer of ISLAMI NIZAM..Jinnah requested him to deliver lectures at radio pakistan about " Existance of the islamic state" ..That program continued till Jinnah's death..If he was not in favor of Islamic system then why he did so? It is a blame "Buhtan" that he was a drinker in his leadership era(may be he did so in youth).No such narration can be seen in any of his fellows or even enemies...If a person drinks or eats bacon it cant remain hidden for long time.even his opponents never put such stupid blame on him. Molana Hussain ahmed madni, abu-alkalam azad and otehrs were against a seprate country but no one blamed him for drinking and bacon meat..IOLA dont tell us that he was the zirdari of that era that he used sentiment to gain a country..
You sound like the Hindus who truly believe that Gandhi was a Brahmin
IOLA you reminded me a colleague who once said that Mr Jinnah used to get his clothes washed from England so he was not a freindly person to poor...That was most stupid Objection i ever listened..At that time there was no airline except Isfahani air who had a flight every 15 days in 1948 and it was not upto London...
Ships nowadasy take 24 days transit time upto tilbury or lever pool...How is it possible he did wait for his clothes 56 days(48 days transit and 8 days of process)....
Jinnah was so careful about his expense after being governor general that he rejeted socks worth 2 rupees becasue he was head of a poor country...
No argument should be construed as stupid. :)
You are actually getting in a habit of doing this!
Aww! Well Mianjee, do you think 'I' would say that he did all that? In Pakistan all the books where this fact is published are banned so how can the Pakistanis possibly know that. I do, of course, coz I read too much. No apologies for that!
Everything he did to gain a place to live for the Muslim majority is justified. It is only due to his indomitable will and sacrifices that enabled us to have this country.
Leaving that aside, when you ppl say we should turn to Islam coz it was our idealogy, what kind of Islam do you talk about? See the fundamental dogmas of Islam cannot be strictly followed by any other than the Taliban maybe. Nobody wants a theocratic regime like that of Mullah Omer's in Pakistan.
What do you ppl want then? I just fail to understand that! Would you kindly elaborate?
How can we by turning to Islam turn this country around?
IOLA;
I dont think there is any book which is banned in pak market which is against Jinnah...there are web pages..books...journals....e-mails...which of these you will retsrict.? nowadasy info cant be restricted....
who is askign you to turn to Mulla Umer's islam..??? No one is saying you to take Dupatta so be chill...Moreover we are talking about macro elements of islam like the policies, economics teh over all system...we are not talking about micros like dupatta , dhari, our other minor things....My request is that we should see our Haqooq Ul Ibad in teh light of our base(islam) I am not talkign about Haqooq Ullah..It doesnt make a difference to me that you do veil or go out without it..But it makes a difference if we are being exploited with name of democracy, or capitalism or libralism...
I want our ideology retained becasue it can protect our rights, culture, integrity, identity and soverignity
IOLA: The fundamental of islam are only two:
1-Social justice(equal status fo human being)
2-economic justice(equal distribution of wealth)
The "Allah' right " are unquestionable by any one as Dupatta, namaz, etc...The questionable things are macro factors...
I hope you understand teh difference between taliban islam and real islam...
PBUH didnt come to change the God..Quresh were against him not becasue of his religon or his God ...they were against him becasue he was tryign to pickup Bilal against their level...He was eleminating the discriminationsof poor and rich, black or white ...
Oh I am so fed up of your Islam. There!
The problem with bringing religion into any discussion is to effectively end all 'constructive' dialogue.
Religious discussion revolves around 'tales of the ancients' and only God knows what the ancients truly said and did
When it comes to religion, both sides, religious and secular are passionate about their personal views; though the religious ones reserve the right to violently persuade the secularists if the convoluted arguments fail to sway them.
There is an interesting study that compares the behaviour exibited by religious fundamentalists to drug addicts or more aptly to people suffering from Obsessive Compulsive Disorder. The study, however, fails to answer the question it raises "Does religion lead to OCD or OCD to religion"?
I agree to both Iola and Mianjee.
As far as personal life of Jinnah is concern, I agree to Iowa based on the understanding that all neutral historians see Jinnah as a secular person. He can hardly be called a Muslim based on his lifestyle choices. However, I agree to Mianjee to extent that Jinnah was a strong believer in democratic values and he respected the huge proportion of Pakistani population that wanted Islam to be dominant factor for rules and regulations for our new country.
I am sure that both of you will appreciate the fact that it is not the faith of Jinnah that matters. It is actually the vision of the man that we must all respect. Let me give you a more recent example in this regard. I have personally met and known Ahtezaz Ahsan. He by no standard can be categorized as a good Muslim. But that does not undermine his lifelong efforts and struggle for the independence of judiciary. Similarly Justice Bhagwan Das is a Hindu but his contributions and compromises are far bigger then many.
In short, we should actually look into the contributions that a person makes towards the society and not at personal religious preferences.
As far as secular vs. religious argument is concerned, I sincerely believe in secular values for Pakistan. Let’s for example take Indian model. India is probably the most conservative religious society in the world today. It is hugely dominated by people of Hindu faith. However, they have managed to create a secular state where religion is matter of ones personal choice and states stays neutral on religious issues. Having said that, this is only my opinion and in democracy it is majority decision that must prevail.
Mianjee and Iowa, I am raised by a family with very liberal values and all my friends are from conservative religious families. I am so glad to tell you both that we haven’t been able to find many differences in our ideologies.
Iowa, not every person with religious background is Zia.
Mianjee, not every person with liberal background is Asma Jahangir. These are only the two extremes.
Plant a tree
The whole point is that this is not what I was talking about at all!
The mind should be open to possibilities. That is what learning is all about. Why say no to anything or that this can't be or that can't be? We live in an impossible world in impossible times and still we talk about arguments as stupid. What does this word mean? A viewpoint that doesnt make sense to you maybe but makes perfect sense to the one who is talking about it. He called his colleague's argument or opposition stupid. It can be irritating and hard to comprehend but why can't it be accepted and still refuted? Make the other clarify his viewpoint and then talk it out. I have always spoken about it and argued for this. This is what reflects education!
Khalifah & Iola & Babar...
It doesnt make any glory to islam if we discuss it or not...The all i was talkign about was my belief on islamic policies...becasue i dont think it a religon of just prayers and fasting..Whatever point you raised i relpied on that..If yur are short of objections now pelase dont be harsh as now you started yelling on my ideology...Please see above i have not said your comments stupid becasue i thought you knowlegable.. I said my colleague's comments stupid
Khalifah:
every discussion is fruitful untill it is not gone to ARGUMENTS FOR THE ARGUMENTS. I didnt narrate any ancient story to you..moreover you yourself have a contradiction that when a euorpeon historian tells any thing you accept it weither it is before christ but when a muslim historian tells any thing even just 1400 year back you deny it..None of these two types of historians have any domicile of those chracters nor teh birth certificate of ancient personalities but you trust them becasue they researched on that ..so please dotn be prujidice...a 1400 years back history is supposed to eb more known than 1000 years BC..when you can accept Greek roman history there is no option to reject 1400 years back one
I end up here...i dont want any one to fed up of my islam...when i can listen many many arguments then people should have a courage to listen mine but now discussion is leading to somewhere else so i quit...
Come back right now! I definitely need someone to drive me nuts. Quitting is for cowards!
I always have enjoyed talked to you Mianjee. None of my messages were intended to cause any offence to you or anyone else in this debate. I apologies if any of my views have hurt any feelings.
Plant a tree
Babar...You are a nice person really...I personally like you alot..You are 3rd most humble person at buzzvines...(1st khalifah, 2nd irfan sb), me and IOla stand at short tempered list :)
Iola: nope, you dont want some one to drive you nuts...It is 2nd time when i went against your opinion and found you harsh...In other blog i was saying about criminals and you took it on you...If you dont want to be commented against your opinion please let me know so i keep quite on your buzz, comments and blogs,
this guy who is at number one on ur 'humble person" list....is he a relative of yours or are u hinting at some office colleague???? coz the Khalifah we mutually know, is anything but humble.....
If you are back, well and good and I give a damn to where you do and don't comment. :)
How about trying to live without name calling for a change?
there is some sort of military operation going on in Peshawar right now.....any updates????
Na na na...I remmber when i was new here i was very rash with him on few topics but he listened to my every word and never scolded me for my tone...I admire him for his patience and tolerance....I feel he truely belives in freedom of expression and opinion...
& practice that same freedom with a lot of vigor ;)
Plant a tree
mianjee u mistook his patience for humility???? how can u confuse these two very separate things with each other???
Now you r becomign PHAPHA CUTNI :) ...if i am positive about some one , let me....Toon tay meray concept hee kharab ker rahee hain kuriyay...I am too optimistic about all fellows here becasue Niyyat to allah hee janta hai na
forgot to ask u last time...what does " PHAPHA CUTNI' means??? sounds like some chinese dish
O Pinki.are you not punjabi? it is the most comprehensive and sweet word..It means" the woman who conspires in order to creat unrest amongst families"